Ian: If ‘m to extrapolate what you just said there then if a woman is drinking fluoridated water and she is braes t feeding then somewhere along the line that fluoridated water will not then show up in here breast milk .
Paul: it doesn’t increase it very much. The average level in a non-fluoridated community is about. 004, in a fluoridated community it goes up to about .01. There is an increase but there seems to be a mechanism in the body to keep fluoridate from the nursing infant.
Ian : What else would and we don’t know for sure but what else do you think an increase of fluoride in our bodies for people in different social economic groups or just in different countries what else could fluoride be responsible for that we may not even have science for yet but you suspect that florid e may be a contributing factor in a health issue .
Paul: what we know from around the world in communities which have high natural levels, their so called endemic areas for fluorosis in India and china is that fluorosis has two components. One is dental fluorosis , in the beginning you see dental fluorosis and as a child h grows up some of those children will get skeletal fluorosis when they become adults. it not only attacks the teeth but it attacks the bone and the esteem actually grows out of the bone and the reason why you don’t see the dental fluorosis until the secondary teeth emerge , parents get the shock when the kids are 8 or 9 and the permanent tenth start coming out you see the dental fluorosis , the while specks or streaks on their teeth . That’s because the fluoride is loaded up in the bone, it accumulates in the bone. About 50% more for kids accumulates ion the bone. 50% of all the fluoride that you take in each day from tooth paste, from water or wherever it concentrates in the bone steadily increasing over your life. The concept here is twofold. In the beginning the first symptoms of fluoride damage to the bone and Thais has been observed in India and china and hundreds of studies of symptoms that ids identical to arthritis , stiffness of the joints , pains in the joins , pain in the bone that’s the first symptoms of fluoride poising of the bone and as the fluoride continues to accumulate it makes the bones more brittle and so a big concern is that by the time you have been exposed the 50 , 60 , 70 odd years of fluoridated water then you may see an increase in hip fractures in the alto my . The human studies, the epidemical logical studies are met. some studies have shown an increase in hip fractures, other studies have not found this but again you have only been fluoridated now for 60 years so nan the future we will have people who have lived 70 years , 80 years , 90 years in fluoridated communities and there i think it’s going to become more obvious that we’re not just damaging the teeth of people we are damaging the bones.
The other issues is we can see dental fluorosis but what about what you can’t see, what about the baby. Let’s go back again to the bottle fed baby. That bottle fed baby is get 250 times more fluoride than nature intended. what’s that fluoride doing to the developing brain , the endocrine system , the thyroid glands , the pineal gland and in the fluoridated countries they really haven’t done the studies but we’re beginning to find these studies being done in India and china. Theirs now been 24 studies which show w an association between moderate to high exposure to fluoride and lowered IQ in children and that’s very disturbing and the dosses are not that much higher than what our kids are getting today.
Ian: The argument here is that having a neurological effect?
Paul: it isn’t just we are seeing lowered IQ we know that fluoride damages the brain and ways with these issues because they use high dosages in animal. It’s a question of does you high dose animal experiment give you a good window into a low dose for human beings. That’s why the IQ studies are so important because they are looking at much lower doses than we have used in animals.
Ian: We’re talking about the vase against fluoride in water and the impact on poorer kids. The reason that we can say that is that in certain economic groups they are not going to be likely to use bottle water and other people can use bottled water all the time. Do all bottled water contain fluoride? Do some of them make sure they don’t have it?
Paul: we don’t know. In America the bottle water companies are not required to list the elementally composition but they are in Canada and Europe. If you go to Europe they tell you what the levels are but not in America. We are flying blind on that.
Paul: You need to contact the manufacturer to find out how much fluoride is in the bottle water.
Ian: Some may be fluoride free but they are not advertising that on their bottles.
Paul: Some of them have advertised that they have added floured to the water, nursery water. they are selling water in supermarkets deliberately to give the baby fluoridated water which is absolutely crazy which is crazy because it’s the first year which the kids are most vulnerable to dental fluorosis but to go back to the low income for a moment . This is one of the emotive argument used to promote fluoridate. We have to do this to help poor kids. This is the argument because they are not getting a dental treatment and they can’t afford the tooth treatment. it’s very punishes because as you pointed out its precisely the low income families that cannot afford avoidance measure , either using reversal osmosis distillation or buying bottled water on the one hand and secondly its more than likely that you are going to get poor nutrition from low income families and when you have poor nutrition then fluoride is worse. Fluoride toxicity is exasperated. If you have low calcium , low vitamins and so it’s not only that they can’t avoid it with low income families but you’re going to be more vulnerable . we already now incidentally from the centre of disease and control that clack children and Mexican American children in the united states have higher dental fluorosis rates . The eye have higher rates of dental fluorosis meaning that they are more vulnerable for a variety of reasons. One of them may be what i just say poorer nutrition. Another one is a higher instance of lactose intolerance in back family so they are for a variety of reasons and these warnings are not being given. Nobody is warring parents or any families not to use tap water to make up baby formula. Even if the concern was to end with dental fluorosis which they admit, even if that was the only concern thy should be warning parents not to use tap water to make yup formula but they are not doing that because they are scared of threatening their precious fluoridation program.
Ian: Real quickly you have mentioned the reverse osmosis processes. Are you talking about a pure water system or one of the filters that you would put on a tap does it take the fluoride out?
Paul: Some do but not the cheap ones. The typical carbon filters, the Brita filters and so on they do no remove it.
Ian: We haven’t talked about the cost. About how much s does it cost to add fluoride to the water supply and how do they measure floured in the water supply. Is there a trickle that goes in or are some people getting more fluoride depending on where they are these are the origins of the water system in a community versus other people j that maybe be further away or not. we’ll find out how much its costing and is everybody giving the same amount of fluoride , The Case against Fluoride next on Coast to Cost , This is Ian Punnett.
Again tweeting @deconpunnett. I’ll be doing two shows next week. I’ll be doing the Friday night show and the Saturday night show. i believe i will be in New York city for the premier of The Rise of the Planets of The Apes, very cool and hoping it will be as good as what i saw preliminary what it was shaped up to be . We’ll talk about that next weekend on Coast to Coast and The Case against Fluoride continues, how hazardous waste c ended up in our drinking water and the bad science and powerful politics that keeps it there. They would say follow the money on this. How much is it costing to put fluoride in the water? Who are the people that are getting paid to keep fluoride in the American water system? Only one of eight countries in the world, maybe it’s not a cost basis system alone. We have to re consider that on Coast to Coast this is Ian Punnet.
We’re talking with Dr Paul Connett who is with St Lawrence University as well as the head as the Florida Action Network. The Case Against Florida is actually the name if the book and on any way you look hat fluoride you look at it in terms of is it a medicine then is unethical to give people without them having a choice on it . if its hazardous waste its unethical to give people something which is also used as a poison … omits in ethical to give it to people if it affects different people , in different socio economic grouses differently and then we get into the argument of what is the cost of adding fluoride to water. These are huge water systems so who is paying for that and who is benefiting.
Paul: it’s a huge cost and especially in big cities. It’s costing New York something like 7 our 8 million dollars per year for the chemicals let alone when you have to repair the systems and change the delivery systems. So for big cities we are talking millions of dollars per year, smaller towns thousands of dollars per year. But even that Ian if you were using pharmaceutical grade fluoride, if you were using the same kind of fluoride that is in dental products you could not afford to do this. The only reason the big cities can use fluoride chemicals to use this fluoridation is they are using the hazardous waste largely produced by the phosphate fertilization industry. The phosphate fertilizer when you are making soluble phosphate heats up phosphate rocks with sulphuric acids. This releases two very toxic gasses into the environment. for about a hundred years these gasses decimated the local vegetation , cripple cattle etc. and eventually they were required to put wet scrubbers on a spray of water and that spray of water n converted these gases into a solution called hexaflourotic acid and it’s that scrubbing liqueur , untreated which gets put into tanker trucks and is shipped around the country and put into our water supplies. They can dump this into the sea buy international law. its too concentrated to dup locally bit f they can find d somewhere to dilute this down , the 180 000 to one then they can get rid of it . It’s one of the idiom syncretise of American Hazardous Waste regulations.
If someone buys a hazardous product from you it’s no longer classified as hazardous waste it n becomes a product. that’s what’s happening , i haven’t made it up . This isn’t Monty Pryce and this is absolutely what is happening. We are taking a hazardous waste from the phosphate fertilizer industry and dumping it into our drinking water. The answer to pollution is dilution.
Ian: Say for a water system as big as New York 7 -8 million dollars that’s insignificant though financially and i would imagine for a smaller city it’s not that much money to add fluoride right ?
Paul: Not if you divide it by the population .i cant believe they would accept any taxes of you divide the total by the total number of population it doesn’t seem very much but when you are talking about something that is damaging your teeth and causing dental fluorosis and other problems that’s where the money is going to be and its unnecessary damage to our health.